Goodyear Tires

[stodgman]

I must admit, I am surprised to be considering Goodyear tires for my '02 S2.

I am a little sensitive to wet weather handling. I did a 360 at 80 last spring and I probably would be dead in any other car. I went from a dry road and hit a "river" running across the road from a previous rain storm at 80MPH. The front end was GONE until I passed through the "river" (backwards) and pulled it back out on dry land on the other side.

This experience has raised the priority of handling under wet conditions.

I have read some of the other posts and had tentatively decided to purchase the Bridgestone Potenza S-03 Pole Position's. I then came across the testing on Tire Rack where the Goodyear Eagle FI GS-D3 is very favorably compared with the S-03's ( http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tests/gy_f1_gs_d3.jsp ).

The Goodyears also APPEAR to wear better although comparing wear ratings across manufacturers is questionable. I am a little disappointed that my factory Bridgestone S-02's are gone at 14K miles. The S-02's have a treadwear rating of 140, the S-03's have a rating of 220 and the Goodyears have a rating of 280.

Pricing is not a major issue. From the Tire Rack a set of the S-03's is $613 delivered and the Goodyears are $547. Goodyear is running a special for a $50 gift certificate at Best Buy...The Goodyears look nice from the pictures.

Am I crazy? Any insight? Any experience?

[Greg Stevens]

Well, I don't know about the Goodyear's, but when I got my Mugen wheels I was really hating how I wasn't going to have the OEM S-02's any more. I wasn't looking forward to the S-02 PP's that I was going to outfit the wheels with (since they are 17's). What I found was the PP's were an EXCELLENT tire...I was very pleased with them, even though I only got rained on by accident.

By all accounts, the S-03 PP's are even better all around. They may wear a little faster, but IMO, you cannot get an all season tire that is better than them.

But I would be VERY happy to have gotten 14k out of the S-02's. I think the best I ever got was about 6 or 7k.

I'm sure someone will chime in with experiences with the Goodyears, but the S-03's are my top choice for all around driving based on my expoerience with the S-02 PP's and from what I have heard lots of people say about them.

Sounds like a scary wreck! Glad you made it out OK...

Welcome to the S2KCA's forums!

[dlq04]

You may wish to check out the UK Forum on the S2ki.com site as the Goodyear tire is popular in Britian.

As a footnote the Honda engineers I was chatting with a couple days ago said that Honda spent as long coming up with a final tire for our car (OEM S02's) as they did designing the car... ie, like 3 years! Hard to believe isn't it.

[stodgman]

Thanks guys, I actually did not wreck my car. I got some dings and scrapes from running through the dirt on the debris on the shoulder of the road but I was unbelieveably fortunate (Yes, guardian angel was helping me drive).

I went to the UK forum but I did not see much on tires. I looked a lot on the web and the Firestones are big and popular in Europe.

My sons came home and insisted I look at the Toyo T1-S. They look awesome too.

I probably cannot go wrong with any of the three picks. I have mentally "bought" each one several times today. Depending on the final prices I find I am leaning toward:
1) Toyo T1-S 2) S-03 (VERY close) 3) Goodyear

[DesignKing]

I had a similar expense as yours. I was driving to work on Friday down to Miami where I was driving through a part of I-95 they are doing roadwork on. In Florida you get allot of parts where it will be raining for a half of mile and then stop so I was driving down the road at 90+ at 530am where I noticed it was raining up ahead. I started to feel the car kind of kick-out a little so I slowed up to 45. I was in the left lane about ¼ mile down the road I must have hit a puddle or something, not quite sure but the next thing I know I am doing 3- 360’s and nearly hit the concrete wall dividing north and south bond traffic. As I am in the car I hook through the window and see a tractor-trailer screeching towards me and just stopped about 15-20 feet from me. Needless to say I was very lucky that morning. I feel there was something looking over me. I did some inspection to the rear tires when I got to work and noticed that the inside of the rear tires were significantly more worn then the outer perimeter. Needless to say after a talk with Greg I am buying Bridgestone Potenza’s S-03 Pole Positions tomorrow morning.

[dlq04]

Originally posted by stodgman

I went to the UK forum but I did not see much on tires. I looked a lot on the web and the Firestones are big and popular in Europe.



here's a few threads where Goodyears are discussed... there are more

http://www.s2ki.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=101026

http://www.s2ki.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=82695

http://www.s2ki.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=76018

http://www.s2ki.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=54533

http://www.s2ki.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=134834

http://www.s2ki.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=117299

http://www.s2ki.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=91524

http://www.s2ki.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=108181

[stodgman]

Wow thanks, those links were great. I obviously did not look in the right places although you gave me all the clues I needed. This gave me an opportunity to cruise through the site and find ALL KINDS of useful stuff.

One question, the tire FAQ is referred to a few times. I saw the Special Interest Forum for tires sponsored by Tire Rack but I do not think that is the right one. Does this exist and can someone point me to it?

[stodgman]

I bought the S-3's through Jim@tirerack. These are a safe bet and I loved my S02 OEM's. I also bought a pair of Kumho's for my wifes SUV. Saweeeet !

[dlq04]

Good choice. I leaning that way. I just bought rear S02's but when I go for a full set it will likely be S03's.

[Glider Guider]

Excellent feedback from the Brits... Just before Laguna Seca I put new S02's on, but the new Goodyears looked VERY tempting based on early reports on non-S2000's. I may go for the Goodyears next time.

It seems like almost everyone is all wet, doesn't anyone else drive in dry weather? My main concerns for traction, steering response, & such are on dry roads. We don't get massive amounts of rain in northern California, just our fair share. Most of my wet-weather driving is in masses of traffic full of clueless people, with lots hallucinating that they're about to spin out at 20 mph.

If anyone has dry-road reports on the F1 GSD3's I'd be delighted to read them. And many thanks to the British folks for the first meaty talk I've seen about these tires on S2Ks!!!

[WestSideBilly]

We get a bit more rain than you guys... Usually in random 30-45 minute spurts that come out of nowhere. I like the S02's dry grip, but value not dying slightly higher so I went with the S03s for those "stuck in the rain" situations... I'm going to order a set of Goodyears F1-GSD3s and I'll give you a dry comparison when I find a decent road... :)

[Ulrich]

Originally posted by Glider Guider
It seems like almost everyone is all wet, doesn't anyone else drive in dry weather? My main concerns for traction, steering response, & such are on dry roads. We don't get massive amounts of rain in northern California, just our fair share.
Well, I do, but quite frankly, I am concerned hitting those wet spots on the road from all the sprinkler systems. When I leave my apartment complex in the morning, I always have to drive through a few puddles, and as I turn into the road, the car does the occasional fishtailing just because the tire is wet... Grip is important in dry climates as well.

[rob911]

I have had the F1GSD3's on my '00 for about 3 months now. I killed my original S02's after our last Laguna Seca event. I have been very impressed with the tire. Off the track, it seems the dry performance is about the same as the S02's. I hope to test the track performance at our next event. With our recent rains I have been very pleased with the wet performance. Great improvement over the SO2's. Everything I have read indicates they are an incredible tire. I would recommend them to anyone. My S2000 is straight stock

[dlq04]

rob, thanks for the feedback; since many of us track as well, let us know how that goes.

[zippy]

I got S-03s when I changed wheels in the fall. I do not drive my car in the rain, so wet traction is of no concern to me. I am not as pleased as I was hoping. The S-03s are no where near as good in the dry. The back end is doing a lot more dancing than it did with the S-02s.

Just my thoughts.

[dlq04]

Hum, thanks zippy. Doesn't sound like what I'm looking for, as I do get a few track days in each year.

[Vezna31]

I am on my 3rd set of Firestone Firehawk SZ50-EP. I'm on a second set on my Z28 and my first set on my S2000. I love these tires. They blow away the Goodyear GS-C's and I think they are better than the Bridgestones, plus I got 30k miles out of them on the Camaro. If I hadn't bought the Firestones for the S2000, I would have tried the Goodyear F1 GSD3, but I already knew that I liked them, so I followed my gut. The Tire Rack has great feedback on them. Have fun tire shopping!!

Vinny

[KRPalmer]

I bought a set of Goodyear Eagle F1's. Believe me I wouldn't have anything else. I live in Seattle and we get a lot of rain in the fall and winter. I have had NO problems with traction even in standing water, no hydroplaning. . They shed water like a ducks back and stay firmly on the pavement. I can't comment on the wear yet, I've only had then for 6 months.

The Bridgstones were gone in about 16k.

[dlq04]

Do you folks with Goodyears have larger wheels?

[KRPalmer]

diqo4, I have my Goodyears on my stock 16" wheels.....

[Bob A (SD)]

What size are your Goodyears on the stock OEM 16" rims?

To get the same front to rear staggered ratio and tire diameter as the stock S-02s, the norm is to go with F205/55-16 and R245/45-16 sizes in aftermarket tire replacements.

Everything I've seen indicated that the Eagle F1 GS-D3 does not come in suitable sizes for our stock 16" rims. In 17" or larger absolutely a great choice, but not in 16". Problems in going with non-optimal sizes range from simple speedo errors to compromised handling.

For me, replacements when needed for my 16" OEM rims will be choosen from Bridgestone S-02 and S-03, or Toyo Proxes TS-1. I certainly wish the F1 GS-D3 were available in the right sizes, but......

....unless Goodyear now offers the F1 in the right sizes. Has something changed?




--Bob A

[Vezna31]

Bob,

The rear stock size is 225/50-16. Did I misunderstand what you were trying to say? The Goodyear is available in that size.

Vinny

[WestSideBilly]

I've been using the GS-D3s for a couple thousand miles. Stock size (205-55 and 225-50). I'd say they're a cheaper and slightly better alternative to the S03, but not really a true alternative to the S02. The dry traction just isn't there.

[Bob A (SD)]

Venza31 and WestSideBilly:

Both of you guys are running rear tires that (1) have a diameter different from stock and hence your speedo is off some and more importantly the ABS system can malfunction, (2) the 225 size you picked is much much smaller width tire than stock. Yeah I know the stock OEM S-02 has the same "number" but trust me the stock tire is much much wider than its number would indicate. There is a huge FAQ plus many many threads on S2KI (especially in the TireRack Forum) that spells this out. Net result with such improper setups are screwy and inadequate (some have opined even possibily dangerous) handling as the car was designed and built for the stagger and contact patch reflected in the OEM tires. What I posted above are the EQUIVILENT non-OEM tire sizes to be used to maintain the car's tire geometry.

WestsideBilly:

I'm not at all surprised that you complain about the lack of dry traction with improper sized tires. The tires are deemed great by those who use them in correct sizes on 17 and 18 inch rims... they don't make them in the right size to fit our stock rear 16" rims period.


Here's the FAQ thread and an opening quote:

http://forums.s2ki.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=48572

There has been lots of discussion and I wanted to help clear this up.

This advice applies to the Stock Rims, with NON-OEM tires

If you are not running the OEM tires on the rear of the S2K, you should be running a 245/45/16 in the rear.

Our stock 225 is NOT a real 225 and has a 8.5" contact patch which is the same as just about all other 245's out there.

205/55/16 in the front.

[dlq04]

Bob, I agree. My notes:

Recommended “Non-OE” replacement tire sizes for OE 16" wheel

Front 205 / 55 (no change), Rear 245 / 45 (wider tread and lower profile tire that can be mounted on a 7.5 to 9.0 inch rim) when used with the OE stock sway bars. Go with 225/50/16 when using a heavier front bar.

TireRack recommended replacement tires

For anyone looking for a better ride and better wet traction than the OE S02 tires, the TireRack recommends Bridgestone S03 tires in the front 205 / 55 and rear 245 / 45 sizes.


Bridgestone’s response when asked about the S2000 tires

1) Contact patch is not a recognized number –– it changes with vehicle load, air pressure, etc –– Tread Width is more recognized, but it is not a standardized measurement in the industry. As such, tire width is measured many different ways by the various manufacturers and is not a good point of comparison. Tread pattern and shoulder treatments can make a specific design appear narrower (or wider) and finding an appropriate point from which to measure is sometimes difficult. Casing shape also has an effect on this measurement.

2) Section width is the standardized width measurement in the industry –– this is basically a sidewall to sidewall measurement when the tire is mounted on the measuring wheel (7.0 in. in the case of the 225/50R16). As with all things, there is an allowable manufacturing tolerance (+/-). If a tire is mounted on a wider wheel (7.5" in your case), the width increases by 0.2" per ½" of wheel width. Therefore, a 225/50R16 S02 (OE fitment) on a 7.5" wheel should measure approximately 9.4" (standard rounding assumed). On the other hand, a 245/45ZR16 S03 should measure approximately 9.6" on an 8.0" wheel (measuring wheel) and approximately 9.4" on the 7.5" (the minimum allowable wheel width for this size). So, hypothetically, the OE S02 would be approximately the same width as a 245/45ZR16 S03 on the 7.5" wheel.

3) Honda Motors recommends only the S02 tires (front and rear) for the S2000. This is based on the fact that these tires have been designed in conjunction with Honda engineers to offer the best handling characteristics for the car. We support Honda on this issue and therefore recommend only the OE tires as replacements.

4) The Potenza S03 Pole Position is different in many ways (construction, compounds, etc.) from the OE tire and should not be mixed with other designs on the car.

[Vezna31]

Damn...I just replaced my rear tires a few months ago. Had I known this little tidbit beforehand (I didn't know s2ki.com amd s2kca.com existed at the time), I would have opted for the larger size. :doh: :loser:

Surprisingly, one of the posts over at s2ki was from a guy that works at the tirerack. I ordered all my tires from there. I had to replace my fronts soon after purchase because the alignment was off and the insides wore out. I only replaced the fronts and a guy from the tirerack called me wondering why I only bought 2 tires. I wish I had gotten a call on the second purchase about the size differential. I actually wanted to go to a different size. Oh well...thanks for the info.

VInny

[WestSideBilly]

Originally posted by Bob A (SD)
Venza31 and WestSideBilly:

Both of you guys are running rear tires that (1) have a diameter different from stock and hence your speedo is off some and more importantly the ABS system can malfunction, (2) the 225 size you picked is much much smaller width tire than stock. Yeah I know the stock OEM S-02 has the same "number" but trust me the stock tire is much much wider than its number would indicate. There is a huge FAQ plus many many threads on S2KI (especially in the TireRack Forum) that spells this out. Net result with such improper setups are screwy and inadequate (some have opined even possibily dangerous) handling as the car was designed and built for the stagger and contact patch reflected in the OEM tires. What I posted above are the EQUIVILENT non-OEM tire sizes to be used to maintain the car's tire geometry.


Sorry, Bob, but my GSD3 combo has the same rolling diameter as stock. Any variance would be ±0.1", which is less than 1% (0.7% specifically). And by "much smaller" you mean a 1/4", right? I have a set of 245/45 Kumho tires mounted on OEM rims in my garage, the 225/50 GSD3s, and when I compare them to an OEM S02, the 245 is easily 1/3" wider than the OEM, while the GSD3 is 1/4" narrower... So not every 245/45 is right for the car. If you believe that the car will only handle with the exact patch ratio that Honda speced, than only the OEM S02 would be correct.

Originally posted by Bob A (SD)
WestsideBilly:

I'm not at all surprised that you complain about the lack of dry traction with improper sized tires. The tires are deemed great by those who use them in correct sizes on 17 and 18 inch rims... they don't make them in the right size to fit our stock rear 16" rims period.

Sorry, but I have to call BS on this. I could stuff 285 width GSD3s into the wheel well, and they still wouldn't have the dry traction of the S02. I'm not saying the GSD3 doesn't have great traction, they do, just not S02 levels - regardless of tire width (within reason).

[Bob A (SD)]

dlg04,

I see we're in the same camp. I read what Westsidebilly is saying about his observations in comparative width, but as I say to him here below, that's not what others are saying. Inflated on our OEM rims and with the weight of the car in play, contact patch is said to be much narrower on the F1s in the size he's using... and not just 1/4". But if he's happy that's really all that matters.


Westsidebilly,

No question that not every tire marked with the same numbers (eg 225 or 245-16) are the same, anymore than the wear ratings between manufacturers are comparable. But the counsel here and from where I linked is that to be "safe" go with those sizes on a 16" rim if you're not going with OEM S-02s. The Bridgestones and from what I've heard the Yokohamas are wider in terms of contact patch when inflated on rims sizes in the applicable recommended ranges specified for the tire than other makers. From what you're saying the Eagle F1s are also wider than their size would intimate. I did see where Jim of Tirerack, who specializes in handling the S2000 (and has tried and tried to get their computer database fixed and to educate other Tirerack reps) has posted just the opposite... that the F1s (which he sells) run narrower across the spectrum.

There have been too many instances of handling problems tied to improper offset aftermarket rims and improper sized replacement tires. Mixing brands front and rear can also be a recipe for disaster. As an aside the label the S-02 OEM tires get as bad in the rain is more often than not tied to having less than 4 or 5 32nds tread left. No doubt driver skill is also a factor. So my "put" here is a generalization obviously. There are guys successfully running 16" in front and 17" rims in back .

You cite width measurements and here we need to make sure we're not talking section width but in fact inflated contact patch or tread width. Many makers don't give these specs for their products. I remain unconvinced that the Eagle F1s are available in a suitable size for 16" OEM S2K usage. That's Jim's counsel from Tirerack and I have faith in him. Some of his comments on using the Eagle F1s as you are:

Goodyear does not make a 245/45R16 for the rear of the car. If you use the 225/50R16 rear the tire will be 1.2" narrower tread width. Don't do it. It just isn't a good fit.

The problem with the GSD-3 is they are a narrower tire to begin with. If you go with the OE tire sizes you will loose about 1" or more of tread width on the rear. In the larger wheel sizes you would be OK but the 16" is not what I would recommend.

And his "put" about too great a difference between front and rear tires (not applicable with your setup, but still....):

With this much difference the anti lock brakes will not function correctly. The computer senses if a tire is slowing faster than another and with different heights they will be slowing faster on one end of the car.


Doesn't mean they can't be run, as you are, but they are far from optimal. Keep in mind too that Honda spent a great deal of time developing the S-02s specifically for our S2Ks. Replacement tires that evidence similar geometries (stagger, diameter, contact patch) will, like the OEMs, synergize best with the stock suspension. Most of us go with aftermarket to get improved wear and/or wet weather performance trading off dry gripiness. Tread width and contact patch look to be the biggest shortcomings running 225/50Z16 Eagle F1s:




........................Goodyear Eagle F1 GS-D3........ Bridgestone Potenza S-02........Bridgestone Potenza S-03
Size ..........................225/50ZR16 SL ................... 225/50WR16 92W ............... 245/45YR16 94Y SL
Serv. Desc.............................................. ...................SL Honda S2000
Load Rating
-
UTQG....................................280 AA A..............................140 A A..............................220 AA A
-
Max Load...............................1389lbs........ ........................1389lbs................... ...........1477lbs.
-
Max. Inflation Press.................51psi....................... .............44psi................................ ..51psi
-
Tread Depth.........................11/32nds..............................10/32nds............................10/32nds
-
Rim Width Range......................6-8"................................... 6-8"....................................7.5-9"
-
Meas. Rim Width........................7"....................................... 7"........................................8"
-
Sect. Width............................... 9.1"................................... 9.2".....................................9.6"
-
Tread Width..............................7.3".....................................8.5".....................................9.1"
-
Overall Diam............................24.9"..................................24.8"...................................24.6"
-
Revs Per Mile...........................839................ .................... 840.................................... 847


As for the dry traction, yup unless we go to track compounds nothing street rated really measures up to the S-02s. So I apparently misunderstood your original comment.

--Bob A

[WestSideBilly]

Good points, Bob.

The one thing that irritates me about the whole tire size issue (actually 3 things):

1) The original 245/45 size came from people on the track. My track tires are that size because I acknowledge that the 225/50 isn't as wide as desirable when driving 9/10 or 10/10. But on the street, the difference just isn't as meaningful. I realize some people drive at their limits on the road, which is dumb, so maybe it's meaningful for them.
2) The minor width differences between the various 225/50 aftermarket and the OEM 225/50 is relatively small. The minor width differences between the various 245/45 aftermarket and the OEM 225/50 is relatively small. Yet anyone who runs 225/50 aftermarket tires is told they're running the wrong size. Hell, I had a guy running a 205/265 combo tell me I was running the wrong size :rolleyes:.
3) Particular to the F1 GSD3 - yes, the rear is a bit narrower than OEM. But so is the front. Unlike most of the magazine racers who seem to populate s2ki, I've driven all 3 tires (2 sets of S02s, a set of S03s, and currently on GSD3s). I can assure you the handling is not unsafe. Is it as good as the S02s? No, but that's more due to the tire construction than the width.

As an aside to #3, Check the specs on the front 205/55s. Mind you, "everyone" says to keep the stock size up front. Yet if you use tread width, this may not be wise:

OEM S02: 7.1"
BR S03PP: 7.6"
GY GSD3: 6.7"

But now if you factor in the rear wheel (with rim stretch), you get
OEM S02: 205 front 7.1" 225 rear 8.7", ratio 1.225
BR S03PP: 205 front 7.6" 225 rear 8.5", ratio 1.118, 245 rear 8.9", ratio 1.171
GY GSD3: 205 front 6.7" 225 rear 7.5", ratio 1.119

So, yeah, the 245/45 is closer, but not "perfect", and the worst ratio is about 8% off.

[dlq04]

WestSide Billy, I agree with Bob on the importance of understanding the proper aftermarket sized tire to meet the original setup demands, but I also tend to agree with you with respect to the minimal risk of your purchases. The recommendations of the Tire Rack, track racers, etc. are about achieving optimum performance and sometimes close enough is good enough for most.

What always strikes me as odd is the lengths that Honda went to on the originals. I spoke with several Honda engineers from the Ohio plant who were testing cars at the Gingerman track when I was there, and they said Honda spent as much time on the tire design as they did the car! I quess they were really looking for that extra advantage over the competition but they sure confused things when it comes to alternative tire manufacturers.

[WestSideBilly]

That wouldn't surprise me, Dave. Tire design is not an easy process, which is why most designs stay around for several years, and also why a good design (such as the S02) can hold its own for 5 years. I was quite surprised to see Honda switch to the RE050 for the '04, though that may have been pushed by Bridgestone.

[Rowland]

:thumbsup:

Excellent dialog and GREAT info :brew:.

Thanks to all.

[Bob A (SD)]

WestsideBilly,

Spot on! Your "put" about variances with the front tires from various manufacturers in the same ("recommended") size only complicates the mix. I think I'm approaching things from much the same point of view you are save not wanting to go narrower front and rear contact patches if at all possible. To illustrate I'm 99% sure I'll be slapping Toyo Proxes TS-1s on when my original S-02s get down to 5 or 6/32s (yeah 1/2 the tread and not at their wear bars). The TS-1s in F205/55ZR16 and R245/45ZR16 will both be a bit narrower. And I'll be giving up the grip of the OEM tires for better wet weather trackability. But they aren't as narrow as the F1s you're running. The Eagle F1s are arguably a step up from the TS-1s but what gains may be available with the tread and rubber compounds versus the older Toyo design may be offset by the wider Toyo contact patch. Dunno but unless I learn otherwise my money will be spent on the Toyos.

I don't drive at the edge on the street either but firmly feel that manuverability to avoid incidents may require that extra edge that a wider asphalt purchase may afford. Maybe I'm all wet here but that's my biggest reason for wanting to avoid a set of tires physically significantly narrower than stock.... I want the advantage. Another factor is that I'll be installing a aftermarket front anti-sway bar when the weather permits. That, I understand, won't mix well at all with narrow front rubber -:) Do you run one since you track your S2K?

As our esteemed retired Army correspondent has posted.... this has been a very civil and informative exchange.

--Bob A

Retired "mustang" Naval Officer -:)

[WestSideBilly]

Negative on the front sway bar. My car is bone stock save for a completely redone stereo and the tires.

I would love to maintain the S02's dry grip and contact patch while getting the GSD3's wet grip. The GSD3 is bar none the best high performance tire in the wet right now, which is why it's on my car, while I feel the S02 is "as good as it gets" for dry performance on the S2000. Tread life isn't a big factor, just a bonus as far as the GSD3s go. That combination doesn't exist, though the RE050 may be close.

I've heard good things about the TS-1, so I hope it works well for you.

[crazy's S2K]

I have had goodyear tires in the past on 2 other cars I have owned. The first was a dodge stratus and the second a 2001 Mitsubishi eclipse GT. The dodge was fine because I didnt drive it like a sports car. However for performance like my eclipse they are garbage. I wiould choose the Bridgestones or BF Goodrich g/force tires.

[KRPalmer]

I have Eagle F1's on my '00 S2K, I love em. There especially good on wet pavement. Here in Seattle, we get a lot of rain in the winter and I have never had a problem with traction or losing it. Even taking tight corners and curves I've had no problems. I've experienced no hydroplaning. They are rated a 10 out of 10 for traction on wet pavement. I would recommend A set of Eagle F1's. Anyway this is my opinion and experience.

[silverfoxs2k]

I have still been able to find S02's as recently as a month ago to replace my front tires. I made a trip to the mountains and discovered that my rear tires needed replacing. It was raining hard and the road had worn tire tracks in the asphalt. My rear end was dancing all the way home but I managed to keep the car in the pointed in the right direction. I replaced the rear tires the next day.

I still remember totaling my dad's camaro when I was 16. I hit a river like you described, except the road was turning left and falling away from me and the river was crossing at that point. I hydroplaned and did a 180 after hitting a fire hydrant and tree. I now have a very healthy respect for water.

[WestSideBilly]

Update:

I've got about 6000 miles on my GS-D3s. Tread is still looking good. I expect 12,000-15,000 out of these tires, depending on how many more times I make it to Knoxville.

I ran the dragon two weekends ago, both in my car and in a friend's car running Kumho Victoracers ( :yikes: ). The first time I ran with pressures similar to what I used in the S03PP - 33F/32R. I ramped them up a bit, to 35F/33R, and got considerably better turn in. My conclusion after testing a few other pressures is that the GS-D3 needs more pressure than the S03PP to negate sidewall stiffness differences. They were still not S02 grip levels, but my biggest gripe was aleved. Something to think about if you're running these tires.